Comments on: The Resurrection and the Postmodern Dilemma http://indychurch.org/blog/2006/03/the-resurrection-and-the-postmodern-dilemma/ a small collection of Christians trying to do church a little differently Sun, 07 Sep 2008 14:48:45 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5 By: Rob http://indychurch.org/blog/2006/03/the-resurrection-and-the-postmodern-dilemma/#comment-280 Rob Thu, 21 Dec 2006 17:33:39 +0000 http://indychurch.org/?p=184#comment-280 Moderator: If possible, can you edit my posting, replacing the second paragraph with this modified version? "There is no objective truth: This is true - for man. I think the better phrase he uses is “neutral knowledge.” God’s bias is the only one the counts, though. Man always has a bias and limited knowledge/truth. Modernism believes that man, by the use of his rational abilities, can apprehend truth. He cannot. Lk 24:45 says “Then opened [Jesus] their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures…” Without this, they could not have understood truth. There is truth, but it is only God’s truth from God’s perspective, and we can only apprehend it by His Spirit. The modern church has failed in this and postmodernism is rightly challenging this." Thanks, Rob Moderator: If possible, can you edit my posting, replacing the second paragraph with this modified version?

“There is no objective truth: This is true - for man. I think the better phrase he uses is “neutral knowledge.” God’s bias is the only one the counts, though. Man always has a bias and limited knowledge/truth. Modernism believes that man, by the use of his rational abilities, can apprehend truth. He cannot. Lk 24:45 says “Then opened [Jesus] their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures…” Without this, they could not have understood truth. There is truth, but it is only God’s truth from God’s perspective, and we can only apprehend it by His Spirit. The modern church has failed in this and postmodernism is rightly challenging this.”

Thanks,
Rob

]]> By: Rob http://indychurch.org/blog/2006/03/the-resurrection-and-the-postmodern-dilemma/#comment-279 Rob Tue, 19 Dec 2006 22:04:41 +0000 http://indychurch.org/?p=184#comment-279 I haven't finished the article, but I want to address the 3 points of postmodernism briefly, in particular in response to Hap above. There is no objective truth: This is true - for man. I think the better phrase he uses is "neutral truth." God's bias is the only one the counts, though. Man always has a bias and limited truth. Modernism believes that man, by the use of his rational abilities, can apprehend truth. He cannot. Lk 24:45 says "Then opened [Jesus] their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures..." Without this, they could not have understood truth. There is truth, but it is only God's truth from God's perspective, and we can only apprehend it by His Spirit. The modern church has failed in this and postmodernism is rightly challenging this. The Self: The modern church is very individualistic, and the Church is not supposed to be. It is to be a community. Postmodernism is again rightly challenging this wrong attitude of the modern church. The Story: The modern church has bought into the positivist belief that knowledge has gone from woeful ignorance to enlightenment through rationality (Greek- and pagan-based, now science). What has this done to us and our faith? We even go so far in our thinking, subtly, as to accept a certain attitude that even the writers of the OT and NT were part of this ignorance. Postmodernism has real problems and Satan is using it, but the modern church has helped and is helping him. Postmodernism presents a slap in the face of the modern church to wake it up from some of the modernist lies even Evangelicalism has bought into. Will we wake up? I haven’t finished the article, but I want to address the 3 points of postmodernism briefly, in particular in response to Hap above.

There is no objective truth: This is true - for man. I think the better phrase he uses is “neutral truth.” God’s bias is the only one the counts, though. Man always has a bias and limited truth. Modernism believes that man, by the use of his rational abilities, can apprehend truth. He cannot. Lk 24:45 says “Then opened [Jesus] their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures…” Without this, they could not have understood truth. There is truth, but it is only God’s truth from God’s perspective, and we can only apprehend it by His Spirit. The modern church has failed in this and postmodernism is rightly challenging this.

The Self: The modern church is very individualistic, and the Church is not supposed to be. It is to be a community. Postmodernism is again rightly challenging this wrong attitude of the modern church.

The Story: The modern church has bought into the positivist belief that knowledge has gone from woeful ignorance to enlightenment through rationality (Greek- and pagan-based, now science). What has this done to us and our faith? We even go so far in our thinking, subtly, as to accept a certain attitude that even the writers of the OT and NT were part of this ignorance.

Postmodernism has real problems and Satan is using it, but the modern church has helped and is helping him. Postmodernism presents a slap in the face of the modern church to wake it up from some of the modernist lies even Evangelicalism has bought into. Will we wake up?

]]> By: matt http://indychurch.org/blog/2006/03/the-resurrection-and-the-postmodern-dilemma/#comment-278 matt Mon, 17 Apr 2006 04:05:14 +0000 http://indychurch.org/?p=184#comment-278 I really appreciate the article. I can say with certainty that I don't follow every point, but I know that the church is clearly in a transition: our methods and language that "fit" the modern mind-set is largely failing in the connection to the post-modern. Can we see beyond the simple labels adn see that post-modern humanity is just as starved for The Truth as modern society? As Jesus spoke with the disciples along the road to Emmaus he demonstrated how the TRUTH transcended understanding. That what looked like irrelevance - and even failure - was core to the Story all along. Are we ready to boldly launch off into the adventure: taking the Kingdom into the domain of the 21st century? If we wait for this generation to "return" to where we are comfortable we will fail. I really appreciate the article. I can say with certainty that I don’t follow every point, but I know that the church is clearly in a transition: our methods and language that “fit” the modern mind-set is largely failing in the connection to the post-modern. Can we see beyond the simple labels adn see that post-modern humanity is just as starved for The Truth as modern society? As Jesus spoke with the disciples along the road to Emmaus he demonstrated how the TRUTH transcended understanding. That what looked like irrelevance - and even failure - was core to the Story all along. Are we ready to boldly launch off into the adventure: taking the Kingdom into the domain of the 21st century? If we wait for this generation to “return” to where we are comfortable we will fail.

]]> By: hap http://indychurch.org/blog/2006/03/the-resurrection-and-the-postmodern-dilemma/#comment-277 hap Tue, 28 Mar 2006 19:41:51 +0000 http://indychurch.org/?p=184#comment-277 This article states that there is not such thing as objective truth - do others really believe this? Objective truth abounds in today's world - you cannot be subjective as to whether the sun rises, it simply does, you cannot be subjective as to your name, it simple is. As Christians we cannot be subjective as to whether or not Christ was born of Mary, is the Messiah, died on the Cross of rose on the third day, anymore that we can that God created the earth, Abraham is the father of nations, and on & on & on. Why then, does this author say that there is no such thing as objective truth, and perhaps even more why is it being promoted here? This article states that there is not such thing as objective truth - do others really believe this? Objective truth abounds in today’s world - you cannot be subjective as to whether the sun rises, it simply does, you cannot be subjective as to your name, it simple is. As Christians we cannot be subjective as to whether or not Christ was born of Mary, is the Messiah, died on the Cross of rose on the third day, anymore that we can that God created the earth, Abraham is the father of nations, and on & on & on.

Why then, does this author say that there is no such thing as objective truth, and perhaps even more why is it being promoted here?

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